W.a.r. By Jeff Wilson (Jkwsquirrel)

[glennish]

4 hours ago, jkwsquirrel said:

 He wants to hide the truth from Brett, not reveal it.  Well, he doesn't want Brett to know he knows, he may not care so much about Brett discovering the truth about Jack!  Billy isn't all that interested in stirring up trouble.  He's more interested in protecting himself and being left alone.

I have thought since that chapter that Billy is in a damned if you do damned if you don't situation.  If he tells Brett then Jen and Jack will go after Him. If he doesn't tell Brett then when/if Brett finds out he will very pissed at him.  The classic Kobayashi Maru scenario. Billy sometimes ignorance is bliss. 

[Former Member]

2 hours ago, glennish said:

I have thought since that chapter that Billy is in a damned if you do damned if you don't situation.  If he tells Brett then Jen and Jack will go after Him. If he doesn't tell Brett then when/if Brett finds out he will very pissed at him.  The classic Kobayashi Maru scenario. Billy sometimes ignorance is bliss. 

But there’s always the classic Kobayashi Maru solution: cheat!  ;-)

[Shadow086]

You know, I almost feel bad for Paula after all this.  It must hurt to find out that this is what your own child thinks of you.  But I don't feel bad for her, because she had it coming for a long time now.

 

Granted, we only see Billy's perspective, but she's been doing the "reputation" thing since book 1, and she never gave him a chance to defend or explain himself when he tried.  In turn, that antagonised her to Billy and makes him confrontational when dealing with her.  So she really brought it on herself.

 

I still can't forgive her for throwing out Billy's CDs.  To me, that's when she crossed the line from strict parent to despicable bitch.  I hope Jack spreads rumours about her cheating so she's forced to admit Billy was right about him and his clique.

[Shadow086]

It shouldn't be too long now.

But we reached the end of the book, so that means a few weeks before the start of the next one.  It's going to be hard to wait.

 

I'm glad my rant entertained you, @droughtquake, I got myself quite angry while writing it and I was quite serious on my feelings about Paula.

Edited September 14, 2017 by Shadow086

[glennish]

Biding my time at work waiting to spend some time at "the cabin" tonight.   End of book 5 and then a wait till book 6. 

[Shadow086]

The anticipation is killing me!

[jkwsquirrel]

Whew!  And it's done!  The longest chapter yet.

[Shadow086]

Just wondering after reading the latest chapter, but

Spoiler

am I the only one who wants to see Billy and Brett's wedding now?

 

[glennish]

43 minutes ago, Shadow086 said:

Just wondering after reading the latest chapter, but

  Reveal hidden contents

am I the only one who wants to see Billy and Brett's wedding now?

 

NO.

[Former Member]

4 hours ago, Shadow086 said:

Just wondering after reading the latest chapter, but

  Hide contents

am I the only one who wants to see Billy and Brett's wedding now?

 

Spoiler

You can read William’s Love or A to Z if you want high school students who got married!

 

[Shadow086]

Just now, droughtquake said:

  Hide contents

You can read William’s Love or A to Z if you want high school students who got married!

 

Spoiler

Remember though, they graduate in 2005, so they'll have to wait another ten years to get married.

 

[jkwsquirrel]

Everything's so hidden and mysterious...    lol. 

 

The way I see it, we are years too early for any weddings, both chronologically and historically, but the boys are of an age where they would have been at the front lines of the coming battles that led to the Obergefell decision in 2015.  By then B&B would be in their late 20's.  After all, Jack did say he saw great potential in Billy, and Billy said that he would fight whoever he had to fight to be able to make Brett his husband someday.  My grandest vision for what Billy would become would be someone who would fight for marriage equality.

Edited September 15, 2017 by jkwsquirrel

[Shadow086]

1 minute ago, jkwsquirrel said:

Everything's so hidden and mysterious...    lol. 

 

The way I see it, we are years too early for any weddings, both chronologically and historically, but the boys are of an age where they would have been at the front lines of the coming battles that led to the Obergefell.  By 2015 B&B would be in their late 20's.  After all, Jack did say he saw great potential in Billy, and Billy said that he would fight whoever he had to fight to be able to make Brett his husband someday.  My grandest vision for what Billy would become would be someone who would fight for marriage equality.

Well, you brought up marriage, so now I want to see it.

[Wesley8890]

4 hours ago, glennish said:

NO.

Even without the marriage though they could still have a civil union right?

[Former Member]

57 minutes ago, Wesley8890 said:

Even without the marriage though they could still have a civil union right?

And I attended a Gay ‘wedding’ in the early ‘90s long before it was ever legal!  ;-) 

[Shadow086]

Just now, droughtquake said:

And I attended a Gay ‘wedding’ in the early ‘90s long before it was ever legal!  ;-) 

Do you really think Billy would settle for less than a legally recognised marriage, though? Like Jeff said, his sense of justice wouldn't allow it.  I can see B&B become one of the first gay couples to legally marry in their state.

[Wesley8890]

16 minutes ago, droughtquake said:

And I attended a Gay ‘wedding’ in the early ‘90s long before it was ever legal!  ;-) 

That's like I was watching Roseanne and theory had an actually gay wedding in season 8. This was in '96 or '97

[Former Member]

30 minutes ago, Shadow086 said:

Do you really think Billy would settle for less than a legally recognised marriage, though? Like Jeff said, his sense of justice wouldn't allow it.  I can see B&B become one of the first gay couples to legally marry in their state.

I know several couples that got ‘married’ multiple times. Unofficially, Domestic Partners, and later in various jurisdictions of varying legal recognition.

Edited September 15, 2017 by Former Member

[George Richard]

3 hours ago, Shadow086 said:

Well, you brought up marriage, so now I want to see it.

They just need to go to universities in Massachusetts and get married there.

 

[jkwsquirrel]

On 9/15/2017 at 2:20 PM, Shadow086 said:

Do you really think Billy would settle for less than a legally recognized marriage, though?

I don't think he would stand for that for too long.  Temporarily, sure, but not forever.

[jkwsquirrel]

Well, what shall we talk about today?  How about... sex!  Like that old song, "Let's talk about sex, baby..."

 

Specifically, let's talk about sex and love in WAR.  As you have discovered if you've read my story by now, sex is not a subject that I'm shy about.  There's plenty of sex in the story if you're willing to wait for it.  My goal in writing was to tell a story using the scenes between the boys.  In this topic, I'm going to focus on the early books, Black Summer and Cold Winter.

 

So starting from the beginning, Billy is following in his parents' footsteps, or maybe his impression of his parents; love life.  He is shy, totally inexperienced, and a bit of a prude.  He talks about masturbation as the narrator, but he's horrified to think that anyone would discover that he does it or even knows about it.  Brett is more of a free spirit.  He's not afraid to talk about it.  He uses it to taunt Billy, to get him to loosen up.  In the scene with the porno tape, it's Brett who instigates everything, and Billy has to be badgered into playing along.  Brett is the first one to shuck his clothes, and he makes no secret that he is planning to enjoy himself whether Billy participates or not.  Of course, we know that Brett is hoping that Billy will join him.  Brett may not know exactly what it is he wants from Billy yet, but he clearly wants Billy to open up to him and trust him.  That Billy is willing to go all the way to the finish line is a huge step for him.  He's willing to share something with Brett that he wouldn't share with anyone else.  Brett tests the boundaries right away, willing to touch, willing to taste forbidden things.

 

The boys' interaction with their parents regarding sex tells us a lot about them as well.  Billy is mortified that his mother walks in on him naked.  He's further humiliated when his dad catches him in the act.  Paula is quick to try to move on, to pretend it didn't even happen, but Brett brings it back up.  When George catches him, Billy is so mortified he wants to run away, but George brings him back to the table, allowing his son to explore and grow, surprising Billy with his understanding of what Billy is going through.  We'll see this dynamic play out later, when Paula would rather Billy keep his love life a secret, while George is willing to accept B&B's relationship, and in fact actively encourages it.  In fact, George's ownership of the porno tape is itself a clue that Billy's expectations of his father may not be completely accurate.  George encourages Billy to become comfortable with his body and not be ashamed of his exploration.  The person who Billy thinks his father is doesn't quite match the reality of who George Roberts is.  As for Brett, he's clearly not ashamed of his body once he starts to mature.  He doesn't care if his mother sees him naked.  He often hangs out around the house in just a pair of boxers.

 

As the boys mature, Brett is clearly ready to explore his sexuality more quickly than Billy.  He is willing to wait for Billy, but he is not afraid to push Billy further along.  But Billy is not as much of a prude as he seems.  He is the one who kisses Brett first.  But it is important to Billy that they take their time and really get to know each other more intimately before they become sexual together.  So they wait.  Brett is willing to put off what he really wants because of his love for Billy.  His patience in this area shows that Brett is willing to put Billy's wishes above his own.

 

Well, that's enough for right now.  If this proves to be something you folks are interested in, we can explore the later books as well.  While I certainly don't mind a down and dirty sex scene, I try to make those scenes add to the story, and not distract.  Got any thoughts?  I'd like to hear them!

[glennish]

30 minutes ago, jkwsquirrel said:

 But Billy is not as much of a prude as he seems.  He is the one who kisses Brett first. 

I had noticed that everything except that first kiss was started by Brett.  Billy did have a lot of courage to instigate that first kiss though.  

 

Also I noticed that even though it happened before B&B were officially in a "relationship" Billy did turn down an encounter with Dustin.  I am curious wether that was due to prudishness or because of his relationship with Brett?  What would have happened if instead of leading Billy on, Dustin had come clean about his feelings for Billy at that time??  Would we be talking about different relationships?   Did Brett "win" because he came totally clean to Billy?  

[jkwsquirrel]

29 minutes ago, glennish said:

I had noticed that everything except that first kiss was started by Brett.  Billy did have a lot of courage to instigate that first kiss though.  

 

Also I noticed that even though it happened before B&B were officially in a "relationship" Billy did turn down an encounter with Dustin.  I am curious wether that was due to prudishness or because of his relationship with Brett?  What would have happened if instead of leading Billy on, Dustin had come clean about his feelings for Billy at that time??  Would we be talking about different relationships?   Did Brett "win" because he came totally clean to Billy?  

Yes, and sometimes Brett would go too far, like when he freaked Billy out when he went a little lower on him than Billy was expecting.  The first kiss was Billy's early crowning moment.  He conquered his fears for love.  Awwwww!

 

There were definitely connections between the two scenes of Billy jerking off with Brett and then with Dustin.  Dustin was far more aggressive sexually than Brett was, but more guarded about his true feelings.  Brett was willing to tell Billy everything, but he kept his hands off until Billy was ready.  Dustin went right for Billy's dick, but was unwilling to share even his shallowest of feelings, always being guarded and defensive.  Billy was willing to go further with Brett because Brett was able to understand what Billy was ready for.  With Dustin, Billy got taken by surprise and ended up way over his head.  Once he realized what he was doing, he stopped Dustin from going further.  Of course, a frustrated Dustin then ended up over his head as well when he began his new career in the park.  If Dustin hadn't been so aggressive, Billy might have been more willing to explore with him.  It just shows some of the difference between Dustin and Brett.  The hyperactive one ended up being more patient because he was truly in love, and not just interested in getting laid.

[Shadow086]

2 hours ago, jkwsquirrel said:

Yes, and sometimes Brett would go too far, like when he freaked Billy out when he went a little lower on him than Billy was expecting.  The first kiss was Billy's early crowning moment.  He conquered his fears for love.  Awwwww!

 

There were definitely connections between the two scenes of Billy jerking off with Brett and then with Dustin.  Dustin was far more aggressive sexually than Brett was, but more guarded about his true feelings.  Brett was willing to tell Billy everything, but he kept his hands off until Billy was ready.  Dustin went right for Billy's dick, but was unwilling to share even his shallowest of feelings, always being guarded and defensive.  Billy was willing to go further with Brett because Brett was able to understand what Billy was ready for.  With Dustin, Billy got taken by surprise and ended up way over his head.  Once he realized what he was doing, he stopped Dustin from going further.  Of course, a frustrated Dustin then ended up over his head as well when he began his new career in the park.  If Dustin hadn't been so aggressive, Billy might have been more willing to explore with him.  It just shows some of the difference between Dustin and Brett.  The hyperactive one ended up being more patient because he was truly in love, and not just interested in getting laid.

I'm not sure I'd say Dustin was just interested in getting laid, though.  The way I see it, Dustin was guarded and defensive because of the walls he built around himself.  He didn't really know how to express his feelings and, in his mind, he couldn't afford to make himself vulnerable by opening up to Billy, so he used sex to try to win Billy's affection.  I read Dustin's aggressiveness as him being desperate to feel loved and wanted, and thinking that doing sexual things with Billy was the only way to get Billy to care for him.  Based on what he kept telling Billy, he probably thought that Brett took Billy away from him with the promise of sex, and so it made sense to 'win Billy back' using sex.  If Dustin hadn't been so emotionally scarred by his family, things might have turned out very differently indeed.  I don't know if my explanation made any sense.

 

Now that I had to go over everything that happened, I don't think I could stand reading about Dustin's life falling apart again.  Jeff, I'll be really pissed off at you if Dustin doesn't get his happy ending.

Edited September 19, 2017 by Shadow086

[jkwsquirrel]

So yesterday was focused on those innocent first few chapters.  This time, I'll look at what I was thinking in books 3-4 when it comes to sex and love in WAR.

 

By the time Part 3 came along, Brett was becoming a bit desperate to advance his relationship with Billy beyond what had become comfortable for Billy.  In this book, Brett is the one who pushes the boundaries, while Billy reluctantly comes along most of the time.  I already talked about the scene with Dustin.  Dustin is way too aggressive for Billy.  Though Billy is intrigued by what happens with Dustin, he holds back and eventually cuts off the situation before it goes too far.  Later, when Brett re-enters the picture, Brett finally convinces Billy to confirm their relationship's status, and Brett sucks Billy off for the first time.  Two things; 1. Billy is willing to go all the way to orgasm with Brett, when he was not with Dustin.  2. Billy is entirely focused on his own pleasure in the scene.  As the story moves along, Brett continues to push Billy's boundaries.  He pushes Billy to have sex, but not so aggressively that Billy will shut him down.  Billy is reluctant, of course, because he is afraid of losing control.  Once they cross that bridge there is no going back.  Billy is very tempted, and almost gives in at times, but he keeps holding back.  Finally, Brett goes too far and does something that makes Billy way too uncomfortable and he freaks out.  Though he tries not to show it, Brett is deeply hurt by Billy's rejection.  Brett unloads all of his frustration on Billy, who remarkably doesn't fire back.  Billy understands that Brett is not just some kid who is willing to suck his dick, but is someone who is deeply sensitive and who deserves respect.

 

In part 4, the inevitable showdown between Brett and Dustin happens, and it is vicious.  Billy sees a side of both boys that he is disturbed by.  Brett uses his relationship with Billy to make Dustin angry.  Dustin crosses the line and attacks Billy physically.  The possibility of any kind of love triangle is shattered.  Billy cannot be with Dustin.  They would be toxic for each other.  Dustin spirals out of control after that incident.  Brett comes clean on what he's been hiding from Billy and begs for forgiveness for taking Billy's love for granted.  At that point, the boys finally make love.  It isn't a perfect scene.  It just kind of happens before Billy has time to back out.  Again, Billy is almost totally focused on himself in the scene.  His mind is centered on how good his body feels, and oh yeah, Brett's there too.  It's almost all about him.  He even hurts Brett a time or two by being overly aggressive in his love making.  When it's over, Billy is feeling like a stud, but Brett is changed by the experience at a much deeper level.  Brett begins to feel frustrated that Billy doesn't seem as affected by the encounter as he is.  Brett feels something has changed between them, and Billy is oblivious.  Billy remarks that Brett knows how to make him feel good, but he doesn't seem all that inclined to do the same for Brett.  He just goes into beast-mode and if Brett enjoys it that's good, just as long as he (Billy) gets off.  Brett's frustration builds until he finally snaps on Billy.  In the midst of their reconciliation, Billy finally comes to understand that he has been taking his boyfriend for granted.  It is then that Billy decides to put Brett's pleasure ahead of his own, symbolized by his asking Brett to top him.  Even when he tops Billy, Brett's focus is on Billy.  Brett teaches Billy what it means to be a good lover.  It's not about one's own needs, but about the other person.  Brett takes pleasure in pleasing Billy, and through their love, Billy comes to understand that as well.